User talk:Atsi Otani
Hi Atsura-San!!
1)For the Katamori Matsudaira article, can we use this version Matsudaira Katamori instead? It is very difficult for me. Is it ok for me to merge?
2)Did you know that I lived in Sendai from 87 to 90? I used to study at SENDAI DENPA KOO SEN (仙台電波高専)Soo da be. Nanda cha?
3) I also would like to become a full time translator and would appreciate any information.
4) This is my typical welcome. Wikipedia e yokoso!
Welcome
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Again, welcome! - --Jondel 08:06, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
Re: Miyagi map/Sendai map
- Alas, if it's copyrighted, it's verboten, and should be removed. Even if it's highly modified as I did, it's still no good. We'll have to find a public alternative. Crap. -- William McDuff 22:55, 20 May 2005 (UTC)
- Hmm. Noticed at the bottom of your page that you still seem unsure on the maps. I'll leave it be for the moment, I think, and just continue my work on train stations. --William McDuff 11:17, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
Hi, Otani san, thank you for your contribution to Shinshukyo. Your participant to WP:JCOTW will be also grateful. Cheers, --Larus.r 04:38, 30 May 2005 (UTC)
I Need your help on 'Move Tsushima Islands' Issue
[edit]- Since you seem to be a native, your services in evaluating some of the contentious dispute would be particularly valuable in the following matter. You are the first definitely native Japanese person that I've been able to locate, though I've hopes that a few others I've dropped in on are your countrymen as well; and Well, Tsushima is part of that country, is it not! It only seems fair to have your say in this dispute. This is the generic prefix message I was dropping on a few others that led me to you. Frank
Hi! You appear to be an QUALIFIED interested disinterested bystander... I'm just making the rounds to everyone that has made their mark on Tsushima Islands which lead me to Fg2, (thence to then YOU! Congrats! Booby Prize, but I badly need some responsible People to help me mediate therein that are familiar with things Japanese... errr English! Sorry, but I infer that's still YOU!) in the last month trying to mediate this flaming revert war — I can use your help — Bring lots O water! (Better yet Beer) Frank
- This is the message I've been dropping on anyone on the Talk or Article pages since 13 May, I'd appreciate it if you can familarize yourself on the small article and stand-by to jump in on Tuesday with some cogent watersprays from a logical firehose! Thanks for the trouble -- the issue is trivial, (Is proper name plural or singular, Forsooth!) save there seem to be at least two teens in a war going well over three hundred edits just in this past month, and a further sampling over 70 edits in the past three days! I need help
- I would appreciate a rational explaination (after you read my Comments in the subject dispute Talk:Tsushima Islands), of the arguement or arguments you consider vital and germane to the discusion and vote. Frankly, MOST all of you are being silly over nothing of particular importance, since both names can be redirected into the one used. I have left a comment concerning my contribution to the article, which contribution — seems to have triggered the current edit and revision wars. For that I apologize, but see the Comments on the vote. I am also taking the liberty of putting the vote section AFTER the Comments about same.
- Still, I have just spent over four hours of valuable spare time, and would welcome your thoughts after you read and understand the distinction I put forth between a governments termonology as a governing body and a geographical reference like an archepelego, which it certainly is.
- More to the point, I'd like to see your defense regarding your favorite POV of what I had to say viz a viz the mergest attitude of the senior editors and administrators that frequent the Wikipedia:VfD discussions. To my recollection, I don't recollect any of you hotheads in this dispute ever spending anytime thereon, possibly excepting Mel Etitis, but rarely even then.
- In any event, I'm neutral here, and have asked that the article be kept EDIT FREE for the next three days by placing The Inuse template into it — I'd copyedited over two and half hours before I suspended that effort the other night because this shameful fued was going on — proper English grammer does depend, unfortunately, on whether one uses the plural or the singular. I saved that on my hard drive, but I don't need to wade through yet another 70 edits to finish the job. As it is, this matter will probably double the time it takes for such a simple job.
- If you are local to Japan, some history of the canals or Sea-channel is certainly germane to the ongoing discussion, moreover, any cogent arguement you condsider being particularly telling needs to be clearly repeated in the current on going comments if you want them counted on in the vote.
- I will make sure this message goes to each contributor to the article the past month, so you are not being singled out. Now is the time to take a deep breath, for rational concise summaries, not all the arguing that is so wearisome in 66 printed pages - half a novelette, I'd guess! It's certainly a lot to ask your fellow editors to wade through on a minor issue.
- I will also personally be making sure that at least a dozen other Administrators I'm acquainted with take a look at the debate after the time below. I will in fact ask for twenty commitments, so be clear and respectful of our time!!!
- Thankyou for your time, attention, and good professional behaviour. I'll check the Talk state again no sooner than Monday around Noon (UTC), And ask the uninvolved others to do the same. PLEASE BE CONCISE.
Well that's my heads up, and appeal -- Hope you can help. I really don't have a dog in this fight! If you can alert a few others qualified on matters Japanese, or distinguishing English plurals from singulars, (sort of, sad to say) by all means, please do so!
Deeper Background
[edit]As deeper background, the issue on the table at the moment is the proper name of the article. The real key issue of fact is whether the large island of Tsushima became two islands, de facto in the period 1895—1900. I was 'innocently passing by', as I am working on upgrading articles about the Russo-Japanese War, and so stumbled into this trap with an innocent edit that made sense based a poorly written sentence. I understood it to state that the Japanese Navy had blasted a 2km channel through the Isthmus between Aso Bay and Tsushima Strait. The proper interpretation of that (I now believe) was that they blasted a channel through the 2 km wide isthmus, whereas I understood it to be saying they blasted a 2 km wide channel. Forgive me please, but it was 04:00 local time and I generally get up circa 06:00. Since I was not working the Tsushima Island article other than that, I went onto other things. Meanwhile...
- The fueding warlords escalated their infighting after a lull where they had to now face the fact that I had added attributed historical references, so now reverting was a bad idea!!!
As I had added some of the historical background of the global view of the Japanese at that juncture, my text naturally also absorbed the very text I misconstrued while altering it into good English construction Since I had added impressive historical perspective my error and the history blended to reinforce the interpretation error, which was probably talking about when one of the canals was constructed. The resulting 'good English' paragraph is dissected by me in the section on Talk:Tsushima Islands where I prove it was a circular arguement. Since I had also added several historical references (including publishers and pages in each book) for my material at the same time, so no one actually involved in the project (wars) questioned (Me at least) on the unintentionally transformed arguement... I didn't discover it myself until I once again saw the source text, and realized I really had my head up my rear when I first read it.
- Bottom Line:
- ) We can really use someone that knows or can find out the question of fact - is the 1895-1900 construction project a canal, or something more drastic severing the Island into two.
- ) A Native speaker of Japanese can answer how you Japanese yourselves refer to the Island, and shed light on why English translations of the Tokyo Times refer to Tsushima Islands, while the government (apparently both of Nagasaki and of Japan proper) refer to it as 'Tsushima Island'... which contradictions, act of course, like throwing gasoline on the fire.
Thanks very much in advance! Frank (fabartus@comcast.net)
[[User:Fabartus| FrankB || TalktoMe]] 07:43, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)
You were SOOOO Helpful — MANY THANKS!!!
[edit]Thankyou very very much for your posting on my talk. That clarifys matters greatly, especially the pics. The matter was much muddled, as you will see if you choose to visit the LONG LONG talk page, but your cogent comments are a breath of fresh air, and I'm going to take the liberty of taking them 'AS IS' and posting them (way down) into the MOVE DISCUSSION.
- I'm merely trying to mediate this, and historical readings are as bad as the encyclopedias and acedemic resources (One of whom stated plainly the Island was "permanently divided" 100+ years ago, but He was really trashing some (theory of a) Korean Claim to the Islands (with a bit of wry tounge-in-cheek humor as I read it) in the full context it was given — The sentence he used is poorly constructed and that got put in verbatuum without quotes, so yours truly bent folded, spindled and mutilated it while wincing at the awkward English. THAT product (paragraph) seems to have ignited this most recent furball — so I'm mediating as penance for being foolish enough to edit at 04:00 local (Boston Time). As you say, one author uses an 'S' and another doesn't, so Wikipedia redirects it, done... it's a lot of wasted energy and time over a split hair. The article also discusses the two half-islands, so english grammer gets sticky with the plural, which is kind of where I came in for ACT II, as I was asked as a neutral party to copyedit — which I had to stop doing as the plural-singular is germane to THAT TASK.
- When you finish rumenating on the matter, by all means stop in and VOTE. It's part of your country! Thanks ever so much for the input, and especially your time! Thanks as well for the info on the Japanes BB, I'll post an notice there very soon. Thank very much again! [[User:Fabartus|FrankB || TalktoMe]] 17:18, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)
- Many thanks again for your input. This link should take you directly to the posting I made combining my reply to you and your message to me: It's renamed, just Click (I needed to make the point clear about the professors humor, somewhere! The paragraph was too germane to the controversy to let stand unilluminated. Frank [[User:Fabartus|FrankB || TalktoMe]] 18:18, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)
- Just wanted to drop in and give you a hearty THANKYOU for your Talk:Tsushima Islands efforts. Much obliged!
Translation
[edit]Thank you for your effort at Tsushima. However, I would greatly appreciate if you could help me to translate the following text into English (I cannot read much Japanese), for I need it for wikipedia:
"沿革 史料上の初見は、魏志倭人伝に一大国あるいは一支国としてある。
古くは壱岐のほか、伊伎、伊吉、伊岐、由紀、由吉など様々に表記され、「いき」または「ゆき」と読んだ。令制国しての壱岐国が7世紀に設けられると、しだいに壱岐と書いて「いき」と読むことが定着した。
壱岐国は、「島」という行政単位として壱岐島とも呼ばれ、その国司は島司とも呼ばれた。
国府は石田郡にあった。具体的な場所については諸説あり、遺跡もまだ見つかっていない。 "
Thanks!
Mr Tan 07:15, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Reply to Translation request by Mr Tan
[edit]Mr Tan, since your talk page appears to be protected, I'm replying here for now. I think you want me to translate part of the Iki Province article in the Japanese Wikipedia. Well, here it is.
I have provided a straight translation and a corrected translation, because the original appears to be slightly misleading. However, the straight translation isn't really a straight translation, because I've added some information which is necessary for the average non-Japanese reader.
History (straight translation)
[edit]The first appearance of Iki-no-kuni （壱岐国) in documented history is the Gishiwajinden (魏志倭人伝), a portion of the Book of Wei within the Sanguo Zhi. Iki-no-kuni is called Ikikoku (一大国, or 一支国) within this document.
Iki was written in a wide variety of Kanji in ancient times, such as 伊伎, 伊吉, 伊岐, 由紀, and 由吉. The kanji was read as Iki or Yuki. After Iki-no-kuni was established as a province in the 7th century, the kanji 壱岐 and the reading Iki gradually became accepted as the correct name.
Iki-no-kuni was also called Ikinoshima (壱岐島; literally, Iki island), since its administrative rank was an island. Therefore, its Kokushi (provincial govenor) was also called a Tōshi (island govenor).
Its provincial capital was located in Ishida-gun (石田郡; literally, Ishida district). The actual location is still unknown. Various theories exist in relation to its location, and no historical sites that provide proof have been discovered to this day.
This sub-section is a translation of part of the Iki Province article in the Japanese wikipedia, retrieved 17:44, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC).
History (corrected translation)
[edit]The first appearance of Iki-no-kuni （壱岐国) in documented history is generally considered to be the Gishiwajinden (魏志倭人伝), a portion of the Book of Wei within the Sanguo Zhi. Iki-no-kuni is called Ikikoku (一大国, or 一支国) within this document. According to this record, Ikikoku was ruled by the Yamataikoku and was located approximately 400 km south of Tsushima-no-kuni (対馬国; literally, the Country of Tsushima). If Tsushima-no-kuni was located in the present-day Tsushima Islands, Ikikoku would be located somewhere south of Kagoshima Prefecture, which is quite far from Iki-no-kuni. Therefore, there are alternate theories on the accurate location of Ikikoku. However, in 1993, the Nagasaki Prefecture board of education announced that the Haranotsuji archeological site on Iki Island was the remains of Ikikoku.
Iki was written in a wide variety of Kanji in ancient times, such as 伊伎, 伊吉, 伊岐, 由紀, and 由吉. The kanji was read as Iki or Yuki. After Iki-no-kuni was established as a province in the 7th century, the kanji 壱岐 and the reading Iki gradually became accepted as the correct name.
Iki-no-kuni was also called Ikinoshima (壱岐島; literally, Iki island), since its administrative rank was an island. Therefore, its Kokushi (provincial govenor) was also called a Tōshi (island govenor).
Its provincial capital was located in Ishida-gun (石田郡; literally, Ishida district). The actual location is still unknown. Various theories exist in relation to its location, and no historical sites that provide proof have been discovered to this day.
This sub-section is a translation of part of the Iki Province article in the Japanese wikipedia, and part of the Ikikoku article in the Japanese article, retrieved 18:39, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC).
Atsi Otani 18:41, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I Wonder If You'd Care to Help
[edit]HI! I just posted this list to a contact in Poland versitile in Russian, so I came to think of your similar skills with Japanese... If you have time to skim read a bit, these are my concerns (Which are mainly glossed in the sources I have):
- Have you got any sources on
- when the Russians started building the Railway between Harbin and Chita, Harbin and Vladivostok? (Once known as 'Manchurian Railway' now called China Far East Railway)
- when they moved into Port Arthur and started upgrading it's harbor, port, town, etc. (which seems to have been well before (2-3 years?) the actual lease Kwantung Leased Territory of 1898).
- when they actually started building a railway South from Harbin, and North from Port Arthur? (i.e. eventually became the South Manchurian Railway)
- Also whether and hence when they 'actually leased' the region of the mainline 'Manchurian Railroad' through Harbin (Chita to Vladovostok), and whether that has a treaty specific name such as the Kwangtung...
- In sum, I'm trying to verify and reconcile dates of treaties and leases, et al between all the 'See Also' links at the bottom of the Manchurian Railway and China Far East Railway (which may be merged someday). These of course are also all relevant and important to the whole series of Russo-Japanese War articles, and later Second Sino-Japanese War articles as well as Manchukuo, so I think getting this kind of detail down and correct can be very important, especially in that my sources have indicated Russia almost certainly moved in and started building without permission from Qing China, at least in what eventually became the Kwantung Leased Territory, which information also directly contradicts the Manchukuo article in who built the South Manchurian Railway initially, which should be the Russians, improved and later managed by your countrymen. So I can use the help of someone with your language skills in sorting through such contradictions. Especially if you can access sources I cannot, as I know you can.
- Which language is the Map on Manchukuo annotated in? See I can't even tell that! <G>
==Thanks for Great Work==
[edit]Thanks for the long answer! After seeing that, your email no longer seems so brief! I've been away from the RJW project(s) and Wiki for just over a month, so your delay in getting back to me is right 'On Schedule'... I'm just getting up the courage to reaccess my notes and figure out what's next, assuming my forcast is correct, and I can find some regular Wikitime again soon!
re: ' On other Japanese websites, I was able to confirm that the secret treaty is also called the Cassini Treaty. I then was able to find several English websites that used the name "Cassini Convention" According to information I found on Japanese websites, the convention was apparently signed by Li Hongzhang and the Foreign Minister of Russia (whose name is Cassini, Lobanoff, Lobanow, or Witte - quite a bit of confusion here). '
For one part, See Sergei Witte, who also signed the treaty of Portsmouth ending the war. Teddy Roosevelt made some interesting notes about him that his biographer (Theodore Rex) repeated at some length. Cassini was I believe 'Count Cassini' whose name I've also run across in my research, but alas, I don't recollect why at the moment... I suspect he was perhaps foreign minister during Wittes tenure as finance minister, which overlaps our 1896—1898 window nicely. The 'secret treaty' I've run across was I believe writen in December 1995, or shortly after, (i.e. immediately following Japan's acquiescence to the Triple Intervention), but I don't recollect it's scope, save the historian was not focused on the CER or SMR, but Port Arthur. I'll let you know once I review.
I was about to go to bed (it's 03:01) and came up from working to check email messages. Some magnet pulled me to check Wiki messages as well, since I played hookey yesterday from work and snuck onto Wiki to make a correction I'd noted on my 'To-Do List' and did some significant flyby edits for far too long, and in too much depth as a result. (Like eating one peanut- it's tough to stop once I get up a head of steam!) In any event, my brain is fried at the moment, so other than seeing that you really made a great effort on the questions, I'm not assimulating too much else right now, except that it looks as if you've confirmed my treaty dates with a couple of other sources. Some of your other comments look to be perhaps even more valuable.
- FYI, Li Hongzhang was the Quang minister that essentially begged the Russians to take the high road and 'at least clothe their (China) nakedness with a scrap of paper' (paraphrased - I'll forward the proper quote later) which was the Kwantung Lease, and that report by a noted historian essentially triggered this whole line of investigation. Apparently Russia was in de facto possession of the territory before that signing, iirc, august of '98, and was ready to simply annex the region. 'Admiral Alexioff' came on the scene shortly afterward, if I recollect the timeline correctly.
- Another pointer is that there was significant commercial development of Dalian (The Russians founded it as 'Dalney'), but when the Tsar's cousin 'Admiral Alexioff' (sp?!!) took over as governor-viceroy, he wasn't happy with the newly founded town (Dalney/Dalian) and moved the governors mansion down the road to Port Arthur. He took over in '98 as well, which would imply he abandoned the governors mansion he himself had built! Obviously, I need to revisit those references to see if I overlooked anything in context, or perhaps, so something else will now 'jump out' now that I have a better background in the matter. I wasn't really taking notes on anything but battle information, so those chapters need re-read! OTOH, he ('Admiral Alexioff') may have done that because he was an Admiral, and that was where the Fleet was hanging out. In sum, there are sufficient 'Circumstansual' reports that indicate a lot of Russian activity and expense in the territories in question to justify digging a little more. One wonders what the PRC consulate would respond if I wrote them! (I need to get it all straight in my head again first! Which means I better get to bed, now!) Sorry about the spelling— mine always sucks in first drafts, so forgive me for thanking you so quickly! I'll peruse your answer in the next day or so, and I'm sure I'll be in touch!
Thanks again, Frank (FrankB 07:14, 13 August 2005 (UTC))
New Japanese City Template
[edit]I've created a new template for Japanese cities based off of Template:Infobox City but reformatted similar to the current one. See the example I put up at Sendai, Miyagi and put feedback either on my user talk page or the template talk page. Please don't use this template as it is currently a test and has not been approved as a replacement by anyone. Thanks!
Also, I'm going to try to do another round of (broken) translating for the Sendai article sometime soon. Thanks for making the minor edits to the last translation I did (English is my primary language, though I learnt both at around the same time). I sent it to peer review about a month ago but I didn't get much of a response, though the only one was helpful. Hopefully after the entire article has been translated from the ja.wikipedia one, put through a good copyedit or two, and given a number of references and external links, we can send it back to peer review and, if the outlook is good, nominate it for FA status!
-Nameneko 07:10, 17 October 2005 (UTC)
Kesennuma/Karakuwa Climate Info
[edit]Just looking to try to get Karakuwa up to FA status before the article should dissapear, and climate info would be useful. Can you tell me where you got your information on Kesennuma from? -William McDuff 03:26, 10 March 2006 (UTC)
Invitation to Wikipedia:WikiProject Japan
[edit]As you are a member of the Japan-related topics notice board, I thought you might be interesting in helping out with our new WikiProject. We'd love to be able to tap into any particular expertise you may have in order to improve Japan-related articles here on Wikipedia. We look forward to working with you. (^_^) --日本穣 06:17, 25 March 2006 (UTC)
- As part of the organization of all the Japan-related projects, the Participant list on the Japan-related topics notice board has been discontinued. If you wish to join WikiProject Japan or one of its related projects, we encourage you to visit the project page and do so. Please let me know if you have any questions. ···日本穣? · Talk to Nihonjoe 19:46, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
If I can trouble you for a little feedback
[edit]I got sidetracked into this 'gem' (Ahem) and we haven't touched base for a while. So I wanted to say Hi! Long time no TsuShima <G>
It's not quite a party, but...
You are cordially invited to pick on Frank:
(Beats handling problems!<G>)
re: Request some 'peer review' (Talkpage sections detailing concerns)] on new article: Arsenal of Democracy
This post is being made Friday 14 April 2006 to a double handful (spam?) of admins & editors for some reactions, and advice (Peer Review) on this article, and it's remaining development, as I'd like to put it to bed ASAP. (Drop in's welcome too!) Your advice would be valuable and appreciated. Replies on talk link (above) indicated. Thanks! FrankB 20:30, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
- I just ripped this off my talk cleaning up for a WikiDayOff tomarrow, and realized you weren't an invitee on the above. Apologies. I've gotten some good input, but can use more. Bear in mind to go to the talk section link first for the brief, then the article. The issue is really how to design an article covering the topic. This 'draft' just sort of 'happened', as is explained. (btw- if you don't like history, don't bother! <G>)
Best!
Matsudaira Katamori
[edit]Hi! I'm translating the article into German and have two questions. As nobody answered on the talk page I'd ask you kindly if you could help me:
- "Katamori tried to achieve peaceful resolutions after the Battle of Toba Fushimi, but members of the new Meiji government refused." Do you know what exactly he tried? I mean, solutions for what?
- Waht is the Ouetsu Reppan Doumei? A party? --Franczeska 21:29, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
thank you!
Many Thanks
[edit]Hi, just wanted to say thank you very much for the writeup you did for Matsudaira Teru. I wrote the original articles for both her and Matsudaira Katamori, prior to both having been trained as an historian and having fully figured Wikipedia out, so I'm sorry for any trouble I've caused. I admire your thorough use of good resources, especially with Teru's article.
On a somewhat related note, I'm glad to see that it's someone from the Tohoku (especially Sendai) writing said articles. Out of curiosity, do you have any resources on Hosoya Judayu?
You may be interested to have a look at the site I assist with: www.shinsengumihq.com , as well as my own site (up but under continuous construction): www.flyingcrane.info
--Tadakuni 17:16, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
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File source problem with File:JozenjidoriAvenue.jpg
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